Alan Browne

[SF]

He's just not the kind of defensive midfielder Lowe wants. He's not creative enough like DJ or a goal threat like Browne to play in the advanced 2, and he's not got the range of passing to supplant Whiteman as the single pivot.

He needs to play in a double pivot, alongside Whiteman. That sacrifices an advanced player though. He's a player built to shield a back 4 imo, but that's not a role we really need.

So do you change the shape to fit Ali, at the expense of players like Hughes and Whiteman who are thriving in their current roles? Or try and wedge Ali in another position, hoping he'll develop there instead? Not an easy decision, imo.

Sums it up really, Whiteman is clearly Lowe's preferred 'deep midfielder' because of his passing, so it's unfortunate for McCann that he never seems to get injured and has avoided suspension.

 

[pne_monster]

He's just not the kind of defensive midfielder Lowe wants. He's not creative enough like DJ or a goal threat like Browne to play in the advanced 2, and he's not got the range of passing to supplant Whiteman as the single pivot.

He needs to play in a double pivot, alongside Whiteman. That sacrifices an advanced player though. He's a player built to shield a back 4 imo, but that's not a role we really need.

So do you change the shape to fit Ali, at the expense of players like Hughes and Whiteman who are thriving in their current roles? Or try and wedge Ali in another position, hoping he'll develop there instead? Not an easy decision, imo.

I've been thinking about this, and in RL's preferred shape (but a slightly different system) it might work something like this. Back 3 with two wider CB's pushing wide, with the wing backs playing almost as wingers, so far this is what we know RL wants. But if you then play AM and BW as a double pivot and one more advanced midfielder in AB or DJ then it might work. I agree with you though in RL's current set up I'm not sure if he fits better than AB or DJ as an 8 and doesn't have the range of passing of BW.

 

[Mooney magic]

Sorry have to jump in here. DJ is an ‘inferior player’ to McCann. What evidence are you basing that on.

DJ - last three seasons alone. 21 goals and 14 assist. Pretty decent.

I think McCann should be given more of a chance but I also don’t think he should be gods gift like some fans make out. His performance against Cardiff twice was shocking so how you think he is ‘much much better’ than a player who has been performing in the championship for years and at a good standard.

I get what fans are saying when they say they want to see McCann more. But he has to do a lot to prove himself better than one of our best midfielders in the last decade.

And you are allowed to have the opinion that Mccan is a much much better than DJ. My opinion is that’s a load of crap. So is the point about the lashers controlling the game. There is only one team that controlled the game on Tuesday. When McCann has 21 goals and 14 assists in three seasons then come back and tell me he is much better than DJ.

Please don't misunderstand me, I think DJ is a good player. Although the stats are seriously inflated by penalties, not many goals from open play. Saying that, penalties can be missed and he has the bottle to step up. Of his 21 goals over 3 years, 12 of them were in 1 season, last 2 years he's been less effective (5 goals then 4).
My main point is that DJ and Browne should not just play regardless of form. McCann is a huge talent, doesn't mean he is God's gift, just that he needs games. Playing 10 mins here and there at left wing-back is not enough. We all have our opinions, mine is that McCann is a better prospect than either Browne or DJ.

 

[Dreyfuss]

He's just not the kind of defensive midfielder Lowe wants. He's not creative enough like DJ or a goal threat like Browne to play in the advanced 2, and he's not got the range of passing to supplant Whiteman as the single pivot.

He needs to play in a double pivot, alongside Whiteman. That sacrifices an advanced player though. He's a player built to shield a back 4 imo, but that's not a role we really need.

So do you change the shape to fit Ali, at the expense of players like Hughes and Whiteman who are thriving in their current roles? Or try and wedge Ali in another position, hoping he'll develop there instead? Not an easy decision, imo.

Reports from Scotland prior to signing suggested that he was a versatile box to box midfielder. Who was good on the defensive side of things but could also get attacks started and also play a good pass. He certainly wasn't just deemed a defensive midfielder.

You talk about browne's goal threat. He's scored twice this season in 30 starts. Browne also has one of the worst accuracy stats in the entire squad. 37 shots. Only 6 on target. He's just ahead of Maguire in the barn door hitting stakes.

I don't think fans have seen enough of McCann to make any kind of decision on what he can offer this team. Ignoring his 45 mins out of position at wingback; in his three other starts under Lowe we won 2 and drew 1. He looked class against Liverpool in the cup too. When brought on in midfield I don't think he's ever really let us down.

He's only 22 years old yet a full international. But I just don't want to see him go the same way as Bayliss. Or be as poorly mishandled as Riis has been in recent months. It doesn't exactly bode well for when the time comes to start blooding youth players either.

 

[Mancunian White]

I've been thinking about this, and in RL's preferred shape (but a slightly different system) it might work something like this. Back 3 with two wider CB's pushing wide, with the wing backs playing almost as wingers, so far this is what we know RL wants. But if you then play AM and BW as a double pivot and one more advanced midfielder in AB or DJ then it might work. I agree with you though in RL's current set up I'm not sure if he fits better than AB or DJ as an 8 and doesn't have the range of passing of BW.

I believe what you're describing there is the WM, but with the W inverted?

I like it.

 

[simo]

I believe what you're describing there is the WM, but with the W inverted?

I like it.

If you play two deeper midfielders then the bodies further forward needs to come from somewhere, probably the wing backs.

If we can find a couple of more attack minded and capable wing backs then it’s easier to see a way big getting Browne and McCann in the same team. Until then, assuming Lowe will continue with wing backs no matter what, it’s between the two of them for that more box to box role.

 

[pne_monster]

I believe what you're describing there is the WM, but with the W inverted?

I like it.

Correct

 

[Mancunian White]

Correct

My issue with that is that it fundamentally changes our style of buildup play. As it stands we basically run two triangles linked by Whiteman. Sepp, Potts and Browne play a triangle on one side with Whiteman dropping deep as a passing option to switch to the left, where Hughes, Greg and DJ have a triangle, or play it over the top to Riis and Archer.

Switch to a double pivot and we lose the ability to build up as effectively on one side, and leaving us exposed to an overload if the opposition breaks, because our sole 10 will have to be dragged wide to be available for a pass. We could play a pure WM instead with one centre forward, but that limits us in different ways, and we don't really have anyone capable in that role imo.

 

[pne_monster]

My issue with that is that it fundamentally changes our style of buildup play. As it stands we basically run two triangles linked by Whiteman. Sepp, Potts and Browne play a triangle on one side with Whiteman dropping deep as a passing option to switch to the left, where Hughes, Greg and DJ have a triangle, or play it over the top to Riis and Archer.

Switch to a double pivot and we lose the ability to build up as effectively on one side, and leaving us exposed to an overload if the opposition breaks, because our sole 10 will have to be dragged wide to be available for a pass. We could play a pure WM instead with one centre forward, but that limits us in different ways, and we don't really have anyone capable in that role imo.

I'm definitely saying it's the answer, and your analysis is really interesting, just wondering how we get AM into the team because I don't think RL thinks he's better than DJ or AB in the current system.

 

[Mancunian White]

I'm definitely saying it's the answer, and your analysis is really interesting, just wondering how we get AM into the team because I don't think RL thinks he's better than DJ or AB in the current system.

I don't think there is an answer really. We've built a squad of specialists.

• Hughes and only effectively play on the left of a three. He's an ok fullback, but he's wasted anywhere else.
• Bauer and Lindsay can only really play in the centre of a three. Neither have the pace or passing range to be reliable in a back 4.
• Pott's can only really play RWB or RM in a 4-4-2. He's an OK CAM, but not ahead of DJ or Browne.
• Riis can only play in a front 2. He's never been effective as a lone striker. (FWIW I think he'd be good on the right wing, provided he didn't need to track back. Let him run at defenders and they get scared)

Taking all of this into account, it seriously limits us. We don't have the personnel to switch to a back 4 regularly. We'd be badly exposed imo.

We can't play a 3-4-3 because we don't have the striker for it.

We can't play your suggestion, because imo we don't have the wingbacks for it. Maybe next season it's a possibility, but I wouldn't bank on it.

 

[Ron Burgundy]

Reports from Scotland prior to signing suggested that he was a versatile box to box midfielder. Who was good on the defensive side of things but could also get attacks started and also play a good pass. He certainly wasn't just deemed a defensive midfielder.

You talk about browne's goal threat. He's scored twice this season in 30 starts. Browne also has one of the worst accuracy stats in the entire squad. 37 shots. Only 6 on target. He's just ahead of Maguire in the barn door hitting stakes.

I don't think fans have seen enough of McCann to make any kind of decision on what he can offer this team. Ignoring his 45 mins out of position at wingback; in his three other starts under Lowe we won 2 and drew 1. He looked class against Liverpool in the cup too. When brought on in midfield I don't think he's ever really let us down.

He's only 22 years old yet a full international. But I just don't want to see him go the same way as Bayliss. Or be as poorly mishandled as Riis has been in recent months. It doesn't exactly bode well for when the time comes to start blooding youth players either.

100% this.

McCann scored, assisted and won a penalty under Frankie, the lad can do it going forward.

 

[pne_monster]

I don't think there is an answer really. We've built a squad of specialists.

• Hughes and only effectively play on the left of a three. He's an ok fullback, but he's wasted anywhere else.
• Bauer and Lindsay can only really play in the centre of a three. Neither have the pace or passing range to be reliable in a back 4.
• Pott's can only really play RWB or RM in a 4-4-2. He's an OK CAM, but not ahead of DJ or Browne.
• Riis can only play in a front 2. He's never been effective as a lone striker. (FWIW I think he'd be good on the right wing, provided he didn't need to track back. Let him run at defenders and they get scared)

Taking all of this into account, it seriously limits us. We don't have the personnel to switch to a back 4 regularly. We'd be badly exposed imo.

We can't play a 3-4-3 because we don't have the striker for it.

We can't play your suggestion, because imo we don't have the wingbacks for it. Maybe next season it's a possibility, but I wouldn't bank on it.

Which is partly due to the level we play at, but also budgetary.