Contracts

[kbd_pne]

Speaking of contracts, we still have another year of Pringle...

Scored on Saturday but by all accounts, he's been pretty anonymous at Oldham too.

Doyle will have takers, but probably another loan for Pringle at best next year.

Not sure what we do about Boyle and O'Connor, won't be easy to move on either.

Then there is Vermijl... he has another year as well, can't see anyone touching him with a barge pole.

Probably £25k a week in wages being wasted on those 5.

Unfortunately with our budget we’ll sign some gems but also waste a lot of money on players that aren’t good enough.

If you look at the improvement in our first team compared to the amount of signings we’ve made in the past 18-24 months, it isn’t great/the hit rate isn’t that high.

O’Connor’s been playing for the reserves at Fleetwood and was hooked at HT in his last first team appearance for them.

 

[Schemer]

Unfortunately with our budget we’ll sign some gems but also waste a lot of money on players that aren’t good enough.

If you look at the improvement in our first team compared to the amount of signings we’ve made in the past 18-24 months, it isn’t great/the hit rate isn’t that high.

O’Connor’s been playing for the reserves at Fleetwood and was hooked at HT in his last first team appearance for them.

And I assume Vermijl is.....injured again.

 

[sedgwick__7]

Alan Nixon on Twitter -

@reluctantnicko: Preston. Taking a good look at Ahearne-Grant. Charlton striker. On loan at Crawley. Real prospect. #bitinpaper

 

[ernest]

Unfortunately with our budget we’ll sign some gems but also waste a lot of money on players that aren’t good enough.

If you look at our Irish signings then the balance sheet is probably:

*Boyle - maybe Div 1 standard.
*O'Connor - as for Boyle but with odd flashes of a bit more.

Ultimately neither good enough for Championship side with Premiership ambitions.

Horgan - lacks guile but not energy and application. Could yet make a useful Championship player.
Maguire - if he carries on as at present could become stupendous player and one of best signings in past 20 years.

On a win some/lose some basis that is pretty well a 50-50 balance which is not too bad when you think about it.

 

[Nishtar36]

If you look at our Irish signings then the balance sheet is probably:

*Boyle - maybe Div 1 standard.
*O'Connor - as for Boyle but with odd flashes of a bit more.

Ultimately neither good enough for Championship side with Premiership ambitions.

Horgan - lacks guile but not energy and application. Could yet make a useful Championship player.
Maguire - if he carries on as at present could become stupendous player and one of best signings in past 20 years.

On a win some/lose some basis that is pretty well a 50-50 balance which is not too bad when you think about it.

Have you ever described Horgan as anything other than ‘energetic’? All of our attacking players are ‘energetic’.

Horgan is too raw and lacks any sort of consistent end product. He’s not good enough.

 

[ernest]

Have you ever described Horgan as anything other than ‘energetic’? All of our attacking players are ‘energetic’.

Horgan is too raw and lacks any sort of consistent end product. He’s not good enough.

Horgan puts himself about in a way that opponents can find difficult to deal with. Yes other players have got attributes he does not possess but Horgan can harass the opposition both upfield and back in our half and there are times when that can be exactly what you need. An example that I have cited before is the way we attempted to see the game out at Fulham when we used Robinson - a vastly superior finisher to Horgan - as a defensive, right-sided wing-back a position in which he was utterly ineffective. I said at the time that if we had had Horgan on the bench and brought him in for that final 20 minutes things might have been different. It seems that when he came on for Ireland the other day he did OK so there is more to him than just running. As far as I am concerned if we have a squad of 22-24 players then there is room for just one of them to provide what Horgan does.

 

[sedgwick__7]

Horgan puts himself about in a way that opponents can find difficult to deal with. Yes other players have got attributes he does not possess but Horgan can harass the opposition both upfield and back in our half and there are times when that can be exactly what you need. An example that I have cited before is the way we attempted to see the game out at Fulham when we used Robinson - a vastly superior finisher to Horgan - as a defensive, right-sided wing-back a position in which he was utterly ineffective. I said at the time that if we had had Horgan on the bench and brought him in for that final 20 minutes things might have been different. It seems that when he came on for Ireland the other day he did OK so there is more to him than just running. As far as I am concerned if we have a squad of 22-24 players then there is room for just one of them to provide what Horgan does.

On Fulham, I really doubt having Daryl Horgan at wing-back would've changed anything. We had multiple chances to finish it off and basically had it wrapped up if it wasn't for one bad bit of judgement by Maxwell from a cross.

Pressing doesn't set Horgan apart from anybody in the squad. Every single one of our attackers and midfielders can/does do it well.

It says a lot that in that paragraph, for an attacking player, you have basically talked about solely defensive attributes.

We need, and have already got, much better attacking quality than Horgan, which is why now with people back fit he does not make the squad.

 

[Nishtar36]

Horgan puts himself about in a way that opponents can find difficult to deal with. Yes other players have got attributes he does not possess but Horgan can harass the opposition both upfield and back in our half and there are times when that can be exactly what you need. An example that I have cited before is the way we attempted to see the game out at Fulham when we used Robinson - a vastly superior finisher to Horgan - as a defensive, right-sided wing-back a position in which he was utterly ineffective. I said at the time that if we had had Horgan on the bench and brought him in for that final 20 minutes things might have been different. It seems that when he came on for Ireland the other day he did OK so there is more to him than just running. As far as I am concerned if we have a squad of 22-24 players then there is room for just one of them to provide what Horgan does.

He doesn’t trouble defenders.

He’s average. Not good enough for promotion chasers.

 

[ernest]

As for Fulham, I really doubt having Daryl Horgan at wing-back would've changed anything. We had multiple chances to finish it off and basically had it wrapped up if it wasn't for one bad bit of judgement by Maxwell from a cross.

Pressing doesn't set Horgan apart from anybody in the squad. Every single one of our attackers and midfielders can/does do it well.

It says a lot that in that paragraph, for an attacking player, you have basically talked about solely defensive attributes.

We need, and have already got, much better attacking quality than Horgan, which is why now with people back fit he does not make the squad.

Don't disagree essentially with what you say other than to reiterate then when we started playing Robinson deep wide right at Fulham I could see what was going to happen. Odd match that at half-time I was thinking it would either end 2-2 or 5-0. But no point going on about that now. As you say with a fully fit squad then Horgan gets squeezed out and maybe AN will look to offload him in the summer but I still think he could have his uses. Right now if we do have a fully fit squad then I suppose what we go for should be:

Rudd

Fisher, Huntington, Davies, Cunningham

Pearson, Browne

Barkhuizen, Gallagher, Robinson

Maguire

Subs: Maxwell, Clarke, Earl, Harrop, Johnson, Bodin, Moult

I don't think we have yet put out precisely that combination of players - perhaps we might finally do so on Friday.

 

[sedgwick__7]

Rudd

Fisher, Huntington, Davies, Cunningham

Pearson, Browne

Barkhuizen, Gallagher, Robinson

Maguire

Subs: Maxwell, Clarke, Earl, Harrop, Johnson, Bodin, Moult

I don't think we have yet put out precisely that combination of players - perhaps we might finally do so on Friday.

Yes that does appear to be Neil's preferred starting eleven and bench, with everyone fit. Johnson and Bodin are the two currently on the bench who've had the most football (Bodin since arriving) and who he'd be more inclined to start than others if there are injuries/changes.

Browne and Gallagher should probably be swapped on your line-up because Neil plays Browne further forward and Gallagher deeper (which is where Gallagher has been playing for over 2 calendar years now - he is no longer a no.10).

 

[Former Member]

He doesn’t trouble defenders.

He’s average. Not good enough for promotion chasers.

I don’t think anyone’s arguing that.

He’s a good player, but you can’t have a squad of 20+ players who are all good enough to chase promotion. Otherwise most of them wouldn’t be here.

You need players outside the 18. Not making the 18 isn’t and shouldn’t be a reason to get rid of someone.

 

[kbd_pne]

Johnson needs to be realistic. He's fallen back to being a squad player this year rather then the integral influence we all hoped that he'd have become by now and the wage he's paid should reflect that.

Thing is, he doesn’t ‘need’ to do anything.

He may not be starting at the moment, but I’m pretty sure if he came available they’d be 2-3 Championship clubs in for him easily offering 15k a week.

I’d like him to stay personally. He’s clearly rated by the manager and has shown many glimpses of being top quality at this level, just still lacks the consistency. He’d be hard to replace at a reasonable price too, and with Welsh almost certain to leave and Gallagher also OoC, ideally we don’t lose anymore midfielders because we need to add there.

 

[Oldbutnotdone]

It's to close to the end of the season with loads to play for to consider contracts.

It's a gamble for the players who may feel they have short changed themselves if we are successful and it's to ridged for the clubs budget if changes are wanted in order to reflect the outcome of the season.

DJ has definately had a better season than last year and is a player we most definately would wish to keep. He does have a price but his contract is not going to reflect anyone who is critical to the success of PNE.

GC is another player with an improved season under his belt. Again I would say he is someone we would keep but not at all costs.

If it's becoming a stalemate then let's have the dust settle on the season first.

 

[Oldbutnotdone]

I can see a couple of players moving on simply to allow Neil the opportunity to claim responsibility for who turns out on match day.

That said - we don't want to sell our assets so there is little manoeuvrability left without hounding out players or paying them off.

 

[ernest]

I’d like him to stay personally. He’s clearly rated by the manager and has shown many glimpses of being top quality at this level, just still lacks the consistency. He’d be hard to replace at a reasonable price too, and with Welsh almost certain to leave and Gallagher also OoC, ideally we don’t lose anymore midfielders because we need to add there.

Welsh has been more or less a nullity this season - however great his contribution in the past - his leaving will make no difference. If Gallagher and Johnson were to go then we would have Pearson, Browne and Harrop which is obviously not enough and would have to bring in at least two new central midfielders. I think we know who one target would be but let' see what happens first.

 

[Nishtar36]

I don’t think anyone’s arguing that.

He’s a good player, but you can’t have a squad of 20+ players who are all good enough to chase promotion. Otherwise most of them wouldn’t be here.

You need players outside the 18. Not making the 18 isn’t and shouldn’t be a reason to get rid of someone.

I agree, but the manager needs to able to trust his squad players - not sure he trusts Horgan. Just like he didn’t trust the ones who left on loan.

Horgan needs to go and be upgraded.

 

[Former Member]

I agree, but the manager needs to able to trust his squad players - not sure he trusts Horgan. Just like he didn’t trust the ones who left on loan.

Horgan needs to go and be upgraded.

But then what happens is, someone better than Horgan comes in and shoves someone else (let’s say Harrop) out the squad.

Then all of a sudden, everyone is saying “get rid of Harrop, he doesn’t even make the 18”.

Reality is I don’t think Horgan is getting games because of the form of our attackers. Barky’s stats speak for themselves, and Robbo has been doing well. Neil can’t spend £500K of the owner’s money on Bodin then leave him out the squad this early on, either.

 

[Nishtar36]

But then what happens is, someone better than Horgan comes in and shoves someone else (let’s say Harrop) out the squad.

Then all of a sudden, everyone is saying “get rid of Harrop, he doesn’t even make the 18”.

Reality is I don’t think Horgan is getting games because of the form of our attackers. Barky’s stats speak for themselves, and Robbo has been doing well. Neil can’t spend £500K of the owner’s money on Bodin then leave him out the squad this early on, either.

Disagree about Harrop, don’t think anyone would be saying that.

I’m not saying get rid of Horgan because he’s not been getting in 18, just don’t think he adds anything as a squad player - and the manager is clearly reluctant to use him.

I’d be surprised if Horgan was still here and we hadn’t replaced him with a bit more potential/quality come September.

 

[California_PNE]

attention mods worried the LEP comments board muppets have arrived

 

[Pilchard]

If you look at our Irish signings then the balance sheet is probably:

*Boyle - maybe Div 1 standard.
*O'Connor - as for Boyle but with odd flashes of a bit more.

Ultimately neither good enough for Championship side with Premiership ambitions.

Horgan - lacks guile but not energy and application. Could yet make a useful Championship player.
Maguire - if he carries on as at present could become stupendous player and one of best signings in past 20 years.

On a win some/lose some basis that is pretty well a 50-50 balance which is not too bad when you think about it.

I don't know whether they are injured but neither O'Connor or Boyle are even making the match day squad at Fleetwood/Doncaster