Goals scored/conceded

[PNEroulette]

Only 5 teams have scored more goals than us this season but we've conceded more goals than anyone else. With Nmecha now on his game and Maguire back, the goalscoring side of our team looks sorted but does yesterdays game suggest the defensive side is close to getting sorted?,imo,no.
Wigans frontline of Grigg and Windass is not very good at this level and they are heavily dependant on Powell ( a class act at this level). Once Powell was injured they offered very little threat. Compared with facing Villa's multi million frontline (Kodjia,Abraham) and WBA's (Gayle) it wasn't a diificult task. If Davies and Hunts had played instead of Clarke and Storey my guess is the result would have been the same . Once exposed to quality again then defensive frailties are likely to reoccur. The confidence a clean sheet brings should help as will Nmecha and Maguires ability to hold up the ball. But in the end it could come down to just focusing on the positive front line scoring as many as possible and hoping the defence doesn't leak more than 1 or 2.

 

[pne4ever]

The main difference between last seasons defence and this is no Cunningham.
Big miss imo.

 

[ernest]

The main difference between last seasons defence and this is no Cunningham.
Big miss imo.

That is the difference in players. But the real difference has been in confidence and attitude - frankly self-belief. Also Huntington is maybe just not quite the player he was. But whatever we just need a few more clean sheets to restore the feeling that we can play whole matches without conceding with some frequency.

 

[Oldbutnotdone]

Yesterday were we're back to our best style of play and set up.

We defended better from the front, the midfield were tight against the defensive back line who were holding the high line.

Crosses were non existent and any high ball tended to be a open play pass rather than a final ball in the box. Shots were few and far between.

I agree re the Wigan team but let's not ignore the points the have on the table.

 

[PNEroulette]

A side that's potentially a lot better at scoring than defending is probably more likely to have either positive or negative results with fewer draws. We could easily win 5 games on the trot at some point in the season to counteract the 4 on the spin we lost. If that was to happen a play off spot isn't out of the question.

 

[sedgwick__7]

That is the difference in players. But the real difference has been in confidence and attitude - frankly self-belief. Also Huntington is maybe just not quite the player he was. But whatever we just need a few more clean sheets to restore the feeling that we can play whole matches without conceding with some frequency.

There has been several factors.

The first is that the ball kept coming back due to having no physical outlet up top. Nmecha now seems to have settled in and is putting himself about, and it made a huge difference yesterday. He was exceptional.

Individual performances and mistakes also haven't help. Huntington has been very poor by his own high standards, Clarke has had a few very poor games, and Davies whilst looking the most solid of the 3 has cost us a few goals with a lack of concentration of a mistake.

Tactical issues too have contributed. The full backs pushing up to high and being exposed, changing the formation a lot.

That said it all came together nicely yesterday. I think we are a team that needs to defend from the front, so having a physical presence in Nmecha running the channels and causing havoc, plus Browne pressing their defenders from the 10 position, helps the defence massively. I hope Neil sticks with that defence for the next game, and that midfield 3 is easily our best.

 

[ernest]

There has been several factors.

The first is that the ball kept coming back due to having no physical outlet up top. Nmecha now seems to have settled in and is putting himself about, and it made a huge difference yesterday. He was exceptional.

Individual performances and mistakes also haven't help. Huntington has been very poor by his own high standards, Clarke has had a few very poor games, and Davies whilst looking the most solid of the 3 has cost us a few goals with a lack of concentration of a mistake.

Tactical issues too have contributed. The full backs pushing up to high and being exposed, changing the formation a lot.

That said it all came together nicely yesterday. I think we are a team that needs to defend from the front, so having a physical presence in Nmecha running the channels and causing havoc, plus Browne pressing their defenders from the 10 position, helps the defence massively. I hope Neil sticks with that defence for the next game, and that midfield 3 is easily our best.

Agreed - and it is worth pointing out that Browne was much more effective yesterday than on Tuesday. We will have to do without Pearson in the next match and you would hope that AN will simply slot Ledson in as a like-for-like replacement - he is certainly the closest we have got in that respect. Odd to think that even a fully fit Maguire will probably have to start the next match on the bench given the way Nmecha played yesterday.

 

[Nishtar36]

There has been several factors.

The first is that the ball kept coming back due to having no physical outlet up top. Nmecha now seems to have settled in and is putting himself about, and it made a huge difference yesterday. He was exceptional.

Individual performances and mistakes also haven't help. Huntington has been very poor by his own high standards, Clarke has had a few very poor games, and Davies whilst looking the most solid of the 3 has cost us a few goals with a lack of concentration of a mistake.

Tactical issues too have contributed. The full backs pushing up to high and being exposed, changing the formation a lot.

That said it all came together nicely yesterday. I think we are a team that needs to defend from the front, so having a physical presence in Nmecha running the channels and causing havoc, plus Browne pressing their defenders from the 10 position, helps the defence massively. I hope Neil sticks with that defence for the next game, and that midfield 3 is easily our best.

As I said yesterday, it’s mad what a physical presence can do for the whole team. Chalk and cheese to Moult who is so easy to defend against.

 

[ernest]

Chalk and cheese to Moult who is so easy to defend against.

I am not certain the Aston Villa defender that Moult beat when he scored on Tuesday would agree. Moult has qualities of his own. When you think that according to requirements we can select three from Maguire, Nmecha, Robinson, Barkhuizen, Moult and Barker as our out-and-out forwards then our striking options do not look too bad.

 

[PNEroulette]

As I said yesterday, it’s mad what a physical presence can do for the whole team. Chalk and cheese to Moult who is so easy to defend against.

A striker with physical presence must help the defence but how much Nmecha's presence is beneficial to the defence depends on what type of balls they send him. Lumping the ball high, like the defence did in the first half ,was a waste of time - though with Hugill it was effective plus Hugill was very effective at defending set pieces whereas Nmecha isn't. But Nmecha has more pace than Hugill ,is technically better and looks very effective when running at defenders. He looks more threatening than Hugill. This could cause more strain on the other sides defence and midfield, and they may commit fewer players forward so helping our defence.
The defenders need to stop lumping balls forward and play the ball to no higher than Nmechas chest or over the top or to the sides to let him run at it. The same probably applies to Maguire.
The Nmecha of yesterday is at least one class level above Moult plus more open to more improvement,imo.

 

[miff]

The main difference between last seasons defence and this is no Cunningham.
Big miss imo.

Last season after 12 games we had conceded 8 goals and had 21 points.

 

[PNEroulette]

Quote Originally Posted by pne4ever View Post

The main difference between last seasons defence and this is no Cunningham.
Big miss imo

Last season after 12 games we had conceded 8 goals and had 21 points.

Cunningham only played in the first 3 then was out injured up to xmas.

 

[Schofe]

The plan for maguire is to play off a striker from one of the flanks, that would certainly have been the case had a target man been brought in. If Nmecha carries on in this way then maguire will go to the flank as opposed to being the number 9

 

[kbd_pne]

The plan for maguire is to play off a striker from one of the flanks, that would certainly have been the case had a target man been brought in. If Nmecha carries on in this way then maguire will go to the flank as opposed to being the number 9

This is what I thought would be the case, and when I said it, was met with stuff like we would we shove a goalscorer out wide etc etc.

If we’d signed Moore or Jerome or whoever for decent money, they wouldn’t have been coming to sit on the bench, and AN played a target man in Hugill every game essentially.

Some of the best football we’ve played under AN was with Maguire off the left off a big man, and I’d expect him to play a similar role again if Nmecha continues to play as well as he did yesterday as the no.9.

 

[Schofe]

This is what I thought would be the case, and when I said it, was met with stuff like we would we shove a goalscorer out wide etc etc.

If we’d signed Moore or Jerome or whoever for decent money, they wouldn’t have been coming to sit on the bench, and AN played a target man in Hugill every game essentially.

Some of the best football we’ve played under AN was with Maguire off the left off a big man, and I’d expect him to play a similar role again if Nmecha continues to play as well as he did yesterday as the no.9.

It was the plan for maguire all along, not sure why people got mad at you as you’re correct in saying out best footy last year was with maguire out wide. He has a burst of pace that most defenders can’t match over 5 yards. Yesterdays 4th was evidence of that. We still needed to bring moore in as well as Nmecha for competition and another option. Moult is more of a 6 yard poacher or someone to bring on when going 2 up top etc. We would have had decent options then and with wide men of robbo, barks, maguire and bodin (obvs injured) but now barker we’d have been well stocked and of course maguire can go up top too.

 

[kbd_pne]

It was the plan for maguire all along, not sure why people got mad at you as you’re correct in saying out best footy last year was with maguire out wide. He has a burst of pace that most defenders can’t match over 5 yards. Yesterdays 4th was evidence of that. We still needed to bring moore in as well as Nmecha for competition and another option. Moult is more of a 6 yard poacher or someone to bring on when going 2 up top etc. We would have had decent options then and with wide men of robbo, barks, maguire and bodin (obvs injured) but now barker we’d have been well stocked and of course maguire can go up top too.

Yeah nobody was ‘mad’ but I just didn’t really fathom the idea that a quite few seemed set on, that any big striker that we signed would’ve been to come off the bench and that’s it. Injury has just compounded that idea as nonsense even further.

When actually given the option of playing Maguire centrally or a big physical presence (Hugill) in the first half of the season, AN always plumped for the latter, and used Maguire off the flank.

I would still expect us to go for a striker in January (Surridge at Oldham being watched very closely), but as you say with players coming back into form and fitness, suddenly our forward options look an awful lot better.

 

[Schofe]

Yeah nobody was ‘mad’ but I just didn’t really fathom the idea that a quite few seemed set on, that any big striker that we signed would’ve been to come off the bench and that’s it. Injury has just compounded that idea as nonsense even further.

When actually given the option of playing Maguire centrally or a big physical presence (Hugill) in the first half of the season, AN always plumped for the latter, and used Maguire off the flank.

I would still expect us to go for a striker in January (Surridge at Oldham being watched very closely), but as you say with playing come back into form and fitness suddenly our options look an awful lot better.

Surridge could be a very shrewd bit of business, albeit league 2 he’s standing out and also for a young lad doesn’t mind the physical battle.
Maguire out wide also shows why we were willing to let horgan go. Only drawback was the injury to Bodin.

 

[WhiteWomble]

I the one game I have managed to get to so far (Derby) the biggest difference from last season was much less of a high-press game, defending from the front. Instead we seemed to sit back much more and invite pressure.