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Matchday Thread Sunderland v PNE - 1/1/24 - KO:12:30pm - Championship

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Matchday Thread Sunderland v PNE - 1/1/24 - KO:12:30pm - Championship

HunterLionheart said:
Aye. He's not a full back and everyone from the Leeds fans to the pundits to the Preston fans said he needed taking out of the firing line.

It's not about having a go at him, but if the goldfish are bringing him up like he's being unfairly sidelined, then it's surely appropriate to remind them exactly why he was justly sidelined.



I think he's a lot worse than Alvaro, purely because he's outdone for pace too, so can't even keep up in a sprint.

If they think his future is as a left winger, fair enough, certainly no argument against giving him minutes from the bench over Brady at this stage. But pretty sure it's far better for his career to be starting games elsewhere and coming back a more experienced player.
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Forget the pace side of things for a moment. The first half of last season Alvaro’s defensive positioning was awful, and certainly no better than Best. He developed into a decent player, mainly because we gave him game time.
 
llanroc said:
Forget the pace side of things for a moment. The first half of last season Alvaro’s defensive positioning was awful, and certainly no better than Best. He developed into a decent player, mainly because we gave him game time.
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But the pace side of things is absolutely relevant. Having recovery pace is a crucial part of being a fullback or wingback. It means if you get caught out of position or upfield, you aren't completely toast. You can still hold up the winger or block a cross.

When you have neither, it means you're fucked if you get caught upfield or out of position.

He needs game time and there's no justification for giving it to him here right now. Let him play lower league football and improve! It's better for him, and it's better for the club.
 
HunterLionheart said:
But the pace side of things is absolutely relevant. Having recovery pace is a crucial part of being a fullback or wingback. It means if you get caught out of position or upfield, you aren't completely toast. You can still hold up the winger or block a cross.

When you have neither, it means you're fucked if you get caught upfield or out of position.

He needs game time and there's no justification for giving it to him here right now. Let him play lower league football and improve! It's better for him, and it's better for the club.
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With the injury record of Hughes, Cunningham and Brady and the potential for Millar to be unavailable at some point I think it’s quite likely Best will get some more game time this season. It’s not like we’re blessed with loads of good options on the left.
 
HunterLionheart said:
But the pace side of things is absolutely relevant. Having recovery pace is a crucial part of being a fullback or wingback. It means if you get caught out of position or upfield, you aren't completely toast. You can still hold up the winger or block a cross.

When you have neither, it means you're fucked if you get caught upfield or out of position.

He needs game time and there's no justification for giving it to him here right now. Let him play lower league football and improve! It's better for him, and it's better for the club.
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Needs to be bullied a bit to toughen himself up.

Needs to learn the hard way.
 
HunterLionheart said:
He got rinsed by Middlesbrough in his last(?) start, and by Harrison Ashby, that illustrious dangerman right back of Swansea too, off the top of my head. It's not like it's just Patrick Roberts who schooled him this year.

The argument of 'our defence is shit, let's make it worse' doesn't wash with me.
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You’re right, let’s keep playing the same guys who have won 4 in 19 rather than a young kid who was a virtual ever present when we were top of the league 🤷‍♂️

He’s got deficiencies but at his age who hasn’t and has his replacement done that much better results wise?
 
llanroc said:
Forget the pace side of things for a moment. The first half of last season Alvaro’s defensive positioning was awful, and certainly no better than Best. He developed into a decent player, mainly because we gave him game time.
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Great shout, we all knew Alvaro was quality and forgave his defensive issues, we’ve now got a kid we own who’s shown real quality as well as his inexperience and lionhearted wants him sending out in loan??
 
Danielson said:
You’re right, let’s keep playing the same guys who have won 4 in 19 rather than a young kid who was a virtual ever present when we were top of the league 🤷‍♂️

He’s got deficiencies but at his age who hasn’t and has his replacement done that much better results wise?
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Scroll back, I've already addressed this fucking awful argument once. Millar is clearly far more an attacking threat. Hughes is a far better defender.
 
Danielson said:
If you think Millar is best suited to LWB then the argument ends here.
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We have played 2 formations. I've given the position he's most likely to play in, for both. If you're struggling to understand the basics, may I suggest you take your own advice and stop.
 
One thing is clear from my perspective is that despite the obvious lack of a real plan for most games I have seen this season, we would undoubtedly be really in the shit if it hadn't been for the consistent performances from Alan Browne whereever he has been asked to play.
It might be a bit early to be nominating for player of the year, but without doubt he has contributed at both ends of the field this season and has been a revelation. God knows how many points we would have at this stage without him being the first name on the teamsheet.
Well done Alan!!
 
HunterLionheart said:
We have played 2 formations. I've given the position he's most likely to play in, for both. If you're struggling to understand the basics, may I suggest you take your own advice and stop.
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You’ve obviously got your badges so I’m probably not in a position to argue
 
HunterLionheart said:
But that's not how you analyse an individual defender compared to his teammates. You could line Virgil van Dijk up with the Blackpool youth team for 10 games, and the fact they have the same results and goals conceded as one another doesn't make them the same quality.

I'd bet heavily that Best has had more serious errors per 90 than anyone else in our squad. The only reason other defenders would come close in total is the fact they've played a lot more!
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Best v Brady? Best 100%. Nuff said
 
65on said:
Best v Brady? Best 100%. Nuff said
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Is anyone advocating for Brady to start? I'm certainly not. He's been just as bad this season, if not worse due to his idiotic red card.

But people are trying to say Best should be starting.

Even if we say Best is a better option from the bench, I can't believe people would rather hamper his development by leaving him to get splinters here than give him the first team football he desperately needs.
 
Gordon Bennett said:
I’m not saying Best is the answer to our defensive woes (I don’t think he is), but I also don’t think he is any worse defensively than Alvaro was when he joined. Yet people were very happy to give him plenty of game time to develop.

I’d actually like to see Best playing in front of a full back as he develops, as his passing and crossing ability is a genuine talent that we should make the most of. If Millar was unavailable I wouldn’t hesitate to give Best some time in preference to Brady.
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Best's best position is midfield going forward and having a cracking at goal. That is what he was doing on a regular basis for the youth team. Manager promotes him to the 1st team and tries to convert him into a full back. WHY?
Especially in pre season friendlies.
 
65on said:
Best's best position is midfield going forward and having a cracking at goal. That is what he was doing on a regular basis for the youth team. Manager promotes him to the 1st team and tries to convert him into a full back. WHY?
Especially in pre season friendlies.
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He was playing as a centre back in the Youth Team? Not in midfield
 
Gordon Bennett said:
I’m not saying Best is the answer to our defensive woes (I don’t think he is), but I also don’t think he is any worse defensively than Alvaro was when he joined. Yet people were very happy to give him plenty of game time to develop.

I’d actually like to see Best playing in front of a full back as he develops, as his passing and crossing ability is a genuine talent that we should make the most of. If Millar was unavailable I wouldn’t hesitate to give Best some time in preference to Brady.
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Best's best position is midfield going forward and having a cracking at goal. That is what he was doing on a regular basis for the youth team. Manager promotes him to the 1st team and tries to convert him into a full back. WHY?
Especially in pre season friendlies.
OB1 said:
He was playing as a centre back in the Youth Team? Not in midfield
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To be fair, it varied depending how the game was going but I see where you are coming from. Good point. I was just trying to emphasise he could do both roles. A bit Greganesque if you know what I mean.
 


These stats are quite interesting. When it comes to PNE's style of play, it seems like we don't have a defined one at the moment.

The individual player stats are the most concerning aspect so far. With the exception of Browne, Millar, and possibly Lindsey based on the stats, all the players have been underperforming. This is especially true for some regular players who consistently get game time, such as Whiteman and Woodman.

The only reason I can fathom for the manager still being in his position is that the January transfer business has already been arranged, and the manager is involved in these arrangements. It's possible that the club doesn't want to risk affecting these deals by making a change in management.
Or they're too cheap to get a worthy replacement/pay off Lowe
 
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