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- Aug 15, 2024
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Wow never realised it was that low,
Heckingbottom
Not for me thanks.
He's full of shit, talks in riddles and way too negative.
Apart from that, he's just about done okay.
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- Dec 13, 2021
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- 4,659
That's because we narrowly avoided relegation last season. If you break it down season by season it's 22.7% in the league last season and 32.6% in the league this season
The thing is win percentage is a bit of a daft metric because the assumption is that wins are the only thing that matters even though vital points can be accrued by drawing games. Points per game is a more suitable metric for this discussion. It doesn't make things look dramatically better but gives a fairer picture at least. It's like if you look at last season, he was earning around 1.14 points per game. Considering how few points we managed to accrue, even the two games where he wasn't manager had a significant impact on our season simply because we failed to earn points from them and we ended up avoiding relegation by 1 point. If I wanted to be generous to Heckingbottom, you could use that 1.14 PPG metric and say that if he was managing the full season, the maths shows we would've earned 52 points instead of the 50 we did earn. Obviously since it's just a hypothetical, it doesn't necessarily mean too much. I do wonder what our season would've been like if he'd managed the full season and had the pre-season too though.
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- Sep 1, 2025
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- 550
What are your thoughts re Hecky's comments when asked about Devine and him (Hecky) having information he wouldn't be sharing.
I actually think it would have been better if anyone had had a proper pre season last season. It wasn’t just a case of a manager coming in after two games with the previous manager overseeing a competent summer, he was arriving to an utter shambles.
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I'll just agree to disagree with you with regards to Heckingbottom Billy.
With regards to Valakari, I'm not gonna pretend to know him well or owt but I'll go by what I can see on paper. A promotion is always achievements so his promotion from the Scottish Championship with St Johnstone is an achievement. I do think it's tempered by the fact that he was managing a team that had been sitting in the top flight for 16 years before they were relegated under Valakari and then promoted again under him. Without knowing too much about him, he wouldn't necessarily excite me as a managerial option.
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- Dec 13, 2021
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- 4,659
We keep comparing Lowe and Heckingbottom on this thread and I've thought a lot about my opinion on Lowe compared to my opinion on Heckingbottom. I've defended Heckingbottom for things I criticised Lowe for and ultimately I was probably unfair on Lowe about some things.
I still think it was right that he left though because I think the crux of why I didn't believe we were going anywhere under Lowe is that he was failing to address (and in fact making worse) the key issues we have to overcome in order to succeed; the quality of the squad declined under him, the number of potentially sellable players saw no change/possibly reduced, he built a squad that was stuck doing his one tactic reducing our tactical flexibility. I still think it was daft that we spent years not signing wing backs for both sides under him even though he was persisting with a wing back formation. Lowe was just too much of a blagger. He was all icing no cake. He kept misrepresenting our situation to the fans and also mis-sold the fans on what was to be expected. His footballing philosophy felt as vacuous as a LinkedIn post.
If I look at what I feel Heckingbottom is achieving; I think the quality of our squad is improving, I think we're managing to accrue more potentially sellable players, and I think we're signing a better variety of players to give us tactical flexibility. When I hear him speak, I think he often says the right things about the position the club is in and what we should expect as fans. I think he also seems to identify and speak openly about key areas that need addressing far better than we've had under any manager in quite a long time. He just seems to get the big picture around the club.
Ultimately, the big question is where do I feel we're heading long term. With Heckingbottom, I can see the implementation of all the elements I think we need to make fighting for promotion easier for us. I fundamentally do not think there is that much difference in just coaching ability between most of the managers in this league so the individual matches themselves don't matter so much to me as long as I feel we're heading in the right direction. I think we are largely moving in the right direction when I compare where we were at the very beginning of last season to where we are now. I don't think we're going to be able to appoint a different manager who will make a substantially positive improvement when working with the same toolset. I think the squad is what we need to fix if we want to go anywhere.
When thinking about a new ownership possibly fixing every issue we have, I think expectations should be tempered somewhat. Financially, I don't expect us to be operating with the same budget Wrexham are in this division even with a new owner. I also don't expect the new ownership to come in and know absolutely everything that needs to be addressed. If they appoint a director of football to oversee transfers, I don't expect the director of football to know all the key issues, strengths and weaknesses of the squad from day one when the summer window isn't actually that far away. I also wouldn't expect a new manager to know everything from day one either. I want the new ownership to be more liberal with their spending but I think it would help a lot having a manager already in place who understands all the strengths, weaknesses and issues within the squad and who has shown he knows how to work with a budget to generally improve the squad but also improve potential revenue within the future by signing good players to develop and possibly sell-on in the future to supplement our transfer budget. This would allow the new ownership to feel more comfortable spending their money rather than feel like they're wasting money.
I was listening to a Spurs fan being interviewed on SSN, he was making a big thing about Lankshear, saying they could have done with him in their squad.
Funny enough, he mentioned a couple of other players but didn't reference Devine.
Whichever league Spurs are in next season they may think it more prudent not to let their better U-21's out on loan?
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Always funny when the low IQ hyper-emotional muppets finally learn what a win ratio is, now all of a sudden it’s a metric which tells the entire story.
Frank de Boer - 55% win% at Ajax, disaster at Inter.
Remi Garde - c.50% win% at Lyon, car crash at Villa in 2015-16.
Nathan Jones - c.50% win% at Luton, to like 15% at Stoke.
Villas-Boas - like 80% win% at Porto, sacked within the season at Chelsea.
So whilst very few on here actually take billymac seriously, just providing a counter-argument for those silly enough to do so.
I think both he and McCall are making it clear that the takeover is happening and they would very much like to be given a chance. I don’t know if this means that we will be able to keep any of the loans but it sounded quite promising.
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- Dec 19, 2004
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It's a completely worthless metric, because clubs have different levels, even within their own divisions.
Are they getting their side to perform above or below the level they're expected to be at, that's by far the most relevant question.
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- Sep 1, 2025
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- 550
Agreed, has Devine's stance changed? I believe you posted he would not sign for Hecky or along those lines previously.
I’ll try and find out. Not had any info lately.
Mixed feelings
The same owners who initially employed them and told them what the budget was
Love or hate them those are the simple facts
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I don’t think it’s worthless if you are comparing it to other managers who have managed the same club.
Comparing a PNE manager to a Bayern Munich manager is worthless but comparing him to other PNE managers isn’t.
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But did they tell them that the budget would get reduced to actually nothing unless players were sold and/or let go?
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- Dec 4, 2005
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When you look at it over the season, despite our awful points pick up from January, we weren’t a million miles off.
In the last minute alone we dropped points against
Middlesbrough H
Ipswich A
Blackburn A
Swansea A
Add a couple more wins to that and we’d have comfortably been in the play offs.
I know it’s all ifs and buts, but I think, and I’m being a hypocrite here as I said it’s probably time for Hecky to go, that with a bigger budget and a new pitch, then he could get us in that top 8.
Equally, I wouldn’t be that arsed if we got a new manager in.
In the last minute alone we dropped points against
Middlesbrough H
Ipswich A
Blackburn A
Swansea A
Add a couple more wins to that and we’d have comfortably been in the play offs.
I know it’s all ifs and buts, but I think, and I’m being a hypocrite here as I said it’s probably time for Hecky to go, that with a bigger budget and a new pitch, then he could get us in that top 8.
Equally, I wouldn’t be that arsed if we got a new manager in.