Matchday Thread PNE v Leicester City - 29/04/24 - KO:8PM - Championship

[IPredictThePlayoffs]

As a Leicester fan, I don't like the parachute payment system.

However, the idea that scrapping them solves the problems with the competitive nature of our league pyramid is simply not true. Scrapping them doesn't bring about 'fairness'.

I'd argue Leicester are the greatest example of this-

How can a team that has achieved more success than Manchester United, for example, in recent years, then be punished, for spending significantly less than them?

But fair play to the FA and the EFL, whilst they both implement/argue over the parachute payment system, they've managed to convince a lot of fans to blame those who are not at fault, instead, having fans of Clubs like Preston blame the likes of Leicester etc, rather than Man City/Chelsea/Man United etc.

We were told FFP/PSR were brought in to stop success resulting from financial power rather than sporting integrity, and also to stop clubs overspending and putting themselves under financial pressure. How's that gone? Man City and Chelsea still out spending all. The system is broken and they want you arguing over parachute payments to hide the bigger picture.

 

[Garden Gnome]

First year ... starting the year after relegation

You are wrong Para.
You were relegated in 22/23. Of course you did not get any parachute payment for that year as you were in the Premier league. BUT, the next year 23/24 you were in the championship so did get the 40/45million mentioned. You are misunderstanding the rules and the years. And yes, the whole of the football league HATES the parachute payments as it massively distorts the league. The clubs you mention have all benefited from them and many were so woefully managed that the money was wasted.

 

[Garden Gnome]

As for blaming the 'bigger clubs' we do!. We don't blame Leicester per say, but the system devised by the Premier League. A closed shop is illegal as it stands but the Premier League rules are as close to a guarantee that the 'big clubs' will not get relegated as is allowed.
Clubs that breach those rules, ie Everton two fines this year, are given meaningless points reductions. Even bankruptcy only allows for a 9 point reduction!
Offending clubs should be thrown out and made to reapply to division 3 or lower. If that were to happen I would respect the Premier League a little more.

 

[joh]

Who is now in prison.

and has had more clubs than Jack Nicklaus .....23

 

[Bodney Rewes]

However, the idea that scrapping them solves the problems with the competitive nature of our league pyramid is simply not true. Scrapping them doesn't bring about 'fairness'.

No one has said it solves all the issues within the pyramid. It is however an issue in the Championship and reduces fairness within this specific league which we're quite conscious of. Never mind how North End can compete, how on Earth can a team like Rotherham compete when half the league have had money from parachute payments to invest?

True fairness can't be achieved but rewarding teams for failing to financially prepare for the cost of relegation from the Premier League is daft. It's as if there isn't a financial cost to being relegated from the Championship, League One, League Two, National League, etc. It's just more special treatment for the Premier League teams.

How can a team that has achieved more success than Manchester United, for example, in recent years, then be punished, for spending significantly less than them?

Not sure which team you're on about here.

Also it's to do with how much income you get. Manchester United are one of the highest earning teams in the world.

But fair play to the FA and the EFL, whilst they both implement/argue over the parachute payment system, they've managed to convince a lot of fans to blame those who are not at fault, instead, having fans of Clubs like Preston blame the likes of Leicester etc, rather than Man City/Chelsea/Man United etc.

We aren't blaming Leicester. We're criticising the system as it is. It gives teams like yours an easier ride in the Championship so that you can bounce back up. You yourself said that you don't like the parachute payment system but now we're not allowed to complain about it because there are bigger issues at play? If you want we could spend our time exclusively talking about the problems of capitalism if you really want us to only speak about the larger issues at play. We could also just speak about humanity's general selfish behaviours. Just because larger issues are present within the system doesn't mean that we shouldn't address other issues too.

We were told FFP/PSR were brought in to stop success resulting from financial power rather than sporting integrity, and also to stop clubs overspending and putting themselves under financial pressure. How's that gone? Man City and Chelsea still out spending all. The system is broken and they want you arguing over parachute payments to hide the bigger picture.

I'm pretty sure they don't really care about us arguing about parachute payments. Plus people can have their attention on two issues at once. It's not an either/or situation. I'm annoyed about Alan Browne's contract situation at the moment but I'm also annoyed about Peter Ridsdale's general incompetence. Conversations on these issues can happen in parallel.

To be honest it just feels like you don't like Leicester being presented in a negative light due to your association with the parachute payments so you're engaging in whataboutism as a way of deflecting the conversation from an uncomfortable area. Plus it feels like you're annoyed at FFP because Leicester are getting punished for their breaches yet Man City and Chelsea are still being investigated.

 

[Para Shoot]

You are wrong Para.
You were relegated in 22/23. Of course you did not get any parachute payment for that year as you were in the Premier league. BUT, the next year 23/24 you were in the championship so did get the 40/45million mentioned. You are misunderstanding the rules and the years. And yes, the whole of the football league HATES the parachute payments as it massively distorts the league. The clubs you mention have all benefited from them and many were so woefully managed that the money was wasted.

As I said ... I'm no expert on this. First time we've been involved (or not ... TBC for me) with it.

I'm struggling to find a definitive online article that clears this up either way.

For instance the wiki article I posted shows no payments the year after relegation.

Watford who went straight back up in 20/21 shows £0

 

[Earlofcurl]

Here we go again. What is it with these relegated clubs saying they don’t benefit from parachute payments?

You get £40-45m if you don’t get promoted in the first season regardless of what position in the division you finish.
You are guaranteed that money. So the owners of that club can go to any bank and say “lend us £30m to keep/buy some decent players and we’ll cover the loan with our parachute payments at the end of the season”.

Can you see the advantage?

 

[IPredictThePlayoffs]

No one has said it solves all the issues within the pyramid. It is however an issue in the Championship and reduces fairness within this specific league which we're quite conscious of. Never mind how North End can compete, how on Earth can a team like Rotherham compete when half the league have had money from parachute payments to invest?

True fairness can't be achieved but rewarding teams for failing to financially prepare for the cost of relegation from the Premier League is daft. It's as if there isn't a financial cost to being relegated from the Championship, League One, League Two, National League, etc. It's just more special treatment for the Premier League teams.

Not sure which team you're on about here.

Also it's to do with how much income you get. Manchester United are one of the highest earning teams in the world.

We aren't blaming Leicester. We're criticising the system as it is. It gives teams like yours an easier ride in the Championship so that you can bounce back up. You yourself said that you don't like the parachute payment system but now we're not allowed to complain about it because there are bigger issues at play? If you want we could spend our time exclusively talking about the problems of capitalism if you really want us to only speak about the larger issues at play. We could also just speak about humanity's general selfish behaviours. Just because larger issues are present within the system doesn't mean that we shouldn't address other issues too.

I'm pretty sure they don't really care about us arguing about parachute payments. Plus people can have their attention on two issues at once. It's not an either/or situation. I'm annoyed about Alan Browne's contract situation at the moment but I'm also annoyed about Peter Ridsdale's general incompetence. Conversations on these issues can happen in parallel.

To be honest it just feels like you don't like Leicester being presented in a negative light due to your association with the parachute payments so you're engaging in whataboutism as a way of deflecting the conversation from an uncomfortable area. Plus it feels like you're annoyed at FFP because Leicester are getting punished for their breaches yet Man City and Chelsea are still being investigated.

Parachute payments are there to try and allow promoted teams to the Top division to be just slightly competitive. Hence I said before, removing parachute payments doesn't remove the head of the snake. The problem is the 'Big 6' and their unwillingness to actually compete. The fact promoted teams need financial guarantees when getting promoted should tell you where the problem lies.

You're arguing about the crumbs that are falling off the table, when the 'Big 6' are having a feast. To be fair you admit that you're very heavily biased as to why you think this way, so I credit you with that.

 

[northend nevets]

Who woke up the fucking Leicester fans? It's not that fucking fox prick from earlier in the season is it? Posts certainly read like it

 

[northender2]

Parachute payments are there to try and allow promoted teams to the Top division to be just slightly competitive. Hence I said before, removing parachute payments doesn't remove the head of the snake. The problem is the 'Big 6' and their unwillingness to actually compete. The fact promoted teams need financial guarantees when getting promoted should tell you where the problem lies.

You're arguing about the crumbs that are falling off the table, when the 'Big 6' are having a feast. To be fair you admit that you're very heavily biased as to why you think this way, so I credit you with that.

Parachute payments arent paid to the promoted teams, they're paid to relegated teams, how does that make them more competitive against the big 6? All they do is reduce the competitiveness of the championship and create a 2 tiered championship of those with and those without the payments

 

[Guinness]

Everyone knows why Leicester went up this season £

 

[Para Shoot]

Here we go again. What is it with these relegated clubs saying they don’t benefit from parachute payments?

You get £40-45m if you don’t get promoted in the first season regardless of what position in the division you finish.
You are guaranteed that money. So the owners of that club can go to any bank and say “lend us £30m to keep/buy some decent players and we’ll cover the loan with our parachute payments at the end of the season”.

Can you see the advantage?

So you are saying it's something that is guaranteed if you don't go up ... to help plan etc

So an advantage

But Leicester won't receive this money and the benefit to us has been the ability to plan and know we had that back up ?

It's all a bit of a minefield mate ... I've been Googling articles and academic papers on this the past hour as I do want to understand

Most articles are a touch vague

 

[deepdaledreamer]

And this is where a lot of people don't know the rules and keep making incorrect calls on parachute payments.

You don't get them if you go back up the same season you come down.

As such LCFC have never received a parachute payment.

They come in for a 2nd season in the Championship.

How can you get promoted in the SAME Season that you got Relegated??

 

[IPredictThePlayoffs]

Parachute payments arent paid to the promoted teams, they're paid to relegated teams, how does that make them more competitive against the big 6? All they do is reduce the competitiveness of the championship and create a 2 tiered championship of those with and those without the payments

Parachute payments are there to ensure promoted teams can risk investing a bit to try and stay up.They are literally guaranteed upon promotion.

How you can genuinely talk about a "Two tier Championship" and not realise it's the same in the Premier League is beyond me. Do you think that's because you haven't experienced the league above?

The exact same hardships PNE feel, is exactly how Leicester, Leeds, Southampton, Sheff United, Forest, Luton, Burnley etc feel about the Premier League.

 

[Soapy]

How can you get promoted in the SAME Season that you got Relegated??

Ian Dowie's bounebackability?

 

[Para Shoot]

How can you get promoted in the SAME Season that you got Relegated??

I meant the next obviously

10 bonus points to you

 

[Soapy]

So you are saying it's something that is guaranteed if you don't go up ... to help plan etc

So an advantage

But Leicester won't receive this money and the benefit to us has been the ability to plan and know we had that back up ?

It's all a bit of a minefield mate ... I've been Googling articles and academic papers on this the past hour as I do want to understand

Most articles are a touch vague

Oh yes you have.

 

[Jürgen Krapp]

How you can genuinely talk about a "Two tier Championship" and not realise it's the same in the Premier League is beyond me. Do you think that's because you haven't experienced the league above?

The exact same hardships PNE feel, is exactly how Leicester, Leeds, Southampton, Sheff United, Forest, Luton, Burnley etc feel about the Premier League.

I don't think people are unaware it's the same, we just don't think that just because it happens at EPL level means it's justified at Championship level too.

 

[northender2]

Parachute payments are there to ensure promoted teams can risk investing a bit to try and stay up.They are literally guaranteed upon promotion.

How you can genuinely talk about a "Two tier Championship" and not realise it's the same in the Premier League is beyond me. Do you think that's because you haven't experienced the league above?

The exact same hardships PNE feel, is exactly how Leicester, Leeds, Southampton, Sheff United, Forest, Luton, Burnley etc feel about the Premier League.

Of course theres a 2 tiered premiership too, you could even say a 3 tiered of the top 6, mid talbe teams and bottom 5, but thats because of the not fit for purpose FFP rules that stop competitiveness at that level and rich foreign owners buying success, it's not because the league reward failure by handing clubs between 40 and 100 million to a handful of clubs while others get nothing

 

[deepdaledreamer]

I meant the next obviously

10 bonus points to you

Thankyou - banked!